Interview with Cléo Michiels, Rémy Gassiat & Théo Friconneau - Ostinato

Francis Kurkdjian Endowment Fund: This year, the project is being implemented for the first time in two correctional facilities simultaneously. What does this change concretely in the structure of the project, and why did you decide to take this step this year?

Théo Friconneau:
“This is the first time we’ve incorporated a theatrical dimension, particularly in the final performance.
One of the unique aspects of this project is that every other year, we carry out what we call, for lack of a better term, ‘outside-the-walls’ initiatives. In the performing arts, this means performing outside of a theater or concert hall.
In the context of En musique pour plus d’humanité (In Music for More Humanity), which takes place in detention centers, the phrase takes on its full meaning. It’s not just about stepping outside a performance venue — it also allows incarcerated individuals to symbolically step beyond their walls.”

Cléo Michiels:
“Outside-the-walls initiatives are only possible in certain types of facilities, particularly detention centers, where sentences have already been handed down. Inmates there know the duration of their incarceration, and some judges can authorize temporary releases so that they can perform in concerts with the orchestra.
That’s not the case in remand prisons, such as Fleury-Mérogis and La Santé, where individuals are awaiting trial. For obvious security reasons, it’s impossible to take them out.
This year, we’re working with these two remand prisons. There won’t be an outside-the-walls concert, but there will be long-term work, which is already quite significant in itself.”

Francis Kurkdjian Endowment Fund: Does this longer timeframe change the nature of your relationship with participants?

Théo Friconneau:
“Yes, absolutely. Usually, projects like this are ‘one-shot’ initiatives — a single workshop, one day, and that’s it.
Here, we’re working over three months, from September to November, with regular sessions. This requires a great deal of flexibility, because between the start and the end of the project, the group evolves: some people may be transferred, released, or sentenced.
We constantly have to adapt, without the possibility of ‘replacing’ anyone. It demands both artistic and human agility.”

Cléo Michiels:
“This extended timeframe also allows for a genuine connection to develop between the artists and the incarcerated participants. It’s not just a fleeting encounter — a real bond of trust and complicity forms over time. During the final performances, you can feel the joy of reuniting and the sense of shared experience.”

Francis Kurkdjian Endowment Fund: How do you select the workshop leaders? What qualities are essential for working in a prison environment?

Cléo Michiels:
“On a human level, we usually call on people who already have experience working in prisons — though it’s not a strict requirement.
For instance, Bénédicte Budan, who is directing L’Histoire du soldat this year, is experiencing this environment for the first time. This is possible today because Ostinato has built solid experience over time: we can now support and train newcomers to this kind of project.”

Rémy Gassiat:
“Ostinato’s young musicians also take part. They’re artists finishing their studies and entering the professional world, selected through auditions to maintain the orchestra’s level.
They’re also chosen for their curiosity and openness — at Ostinato, we encourage a wide range of experiences, from major symphonic repertoires to social and cultural projects.”

Théo Friconneau:
“These musicians are, of course, prepared in advance. The prison administration organizes visits, meetings, and awareness sessions to help them understand the prison environment. It’s a very specific setting that requires careful preparation and discipline.”

Francis Kurkdjian Endowment Fund: How does the bond between musicians, facilitators, and incarcerated participants form?

Théo Friconneau:
“The bond is both artistic and personal. During the first sessions, each musician introduces their instrument and background, and plays a piece that is personally meaningful. This immediately creates a sense of closeness.
The exchanges are incredibly rich — the incarcerated participants are often curious, kind, and genuinely moved that we come not just to play for them, but with them.”

Cléo Michiels:
“Yes, the first encounter happens through music rather than words — it’s very powerful.
I’m thinking of one story: after several sessions, a participant revealed that she played the piano. One day, when a keyboard was available, she began to play — and she turned out to be an exceptional pianist who hadn’t touched an instrument in ten years. It was a deeply moving moment for everyone.”

Rémy Gassiat:
“The bond also takes shape during the final performances.
At Fleury-Mérogis, the inmates sing accompanied by the orchestra.
At La Santé, they perform the roles in L’Histoire du soldat alongside the musicians.
It’s a powerful moment — the incarcerated individuals become artists in their own right.”

Francis Kurkdjian Endowment Fund: Do you maintain contact with participants after the performances?

Cléo Michiels:
“Unfortunately, no. Once they leave, we can no longer be in touch. It’s a harsh and sometimes frustrating reality.
However, it sometimes happens that former participants return to prison years later and join the workshops again. That, in a way, shows a form of human continuity in these projects.”

Francis Kurkdjian Endowment Fund: What have you learned, personally and artistically, from these experiences?

Théo Friconneau:
“I’m reminded of Faustine, a flutist from Ostinato who, last year, was going through a period of professional discouragement. After participating in the workshops, she rediscovered the deep meaning of being an artist — playing for others, sharing emotion.
The experience truly transformed her.”

Cléo Michiels:
“For me, it’s a profound lesson in humanity.
In these workshops, we know nothing about the people we meet — not their history, not their sentence. But music creates a space of equality, trust, and shared emotion.
It’s an honest encounter, stripped of all judgment.”

Rémy Gassiat:
“And for our young artists, it’s as much a civic education as an artistic one. They discover the power of human connection through art.”

Francis Kurkdjian Endowment Fund: As new co-directors, what impact do you have on Ostinato’s direction and projects?

Rémy Gassiat:
“This project was created and led by Emmanuelle Duthu, our former director. We inherited it and are delighted to continue her work.
Emmanuelle now serves on our board and continues to support us.”

Cléo Michiels:
“Rémy and I both come from the world of contemporary and creative music, so we’re considering ways to expand the repertoire even further in the future.
But for now, our priority is to sustain the existing framework, which works very well.
Projects like these couldn’t exist without the support of our partners and foundations, especially financially.
The cultural sector is fragile, and carrying out projects with such a strong human purpose requires real solidarity.
We are deeply grateful to all those who still believe in the power of culture to rebuild connection and humanity.”